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Caveman
Will do! I hope to get there two to three times at least..... plus learn more about the process on what we talked about on the phone. That's the real reason for the two wheel
wheelbarrow. I have a real need to learn how to do this properly. The offer will stand - so if you ever want to take me up on it, just let me know. Right now, it's just a fun
machine, not a money-maker. It needs a thorough work-out, and I hope to give it that this year.

Also, thanks! - "Too cool" has never been an adjective used in the same sentence with my name before. smiley-cool14.gif I am humbled. But... careful - my head may get
way too big for my lion skin and I'll have to join the ranks of the "fancy" lads! smiley-laughing021.gif Karen will kill me if I get a kilt and learn to play bagpipes! laught16.gif
And.... I am way too old to start tossing cabers, although - I have been known to huck some very large rocks...... caveman.gif


Dypheron
And you know I'll be up there helping this summer too Chris, I was already planning on getting a pump, no reason why I couldn't let you break it in up there... Seriously though, you're cool enough to extend the offer to prospect on your claim, no reason to not help you out as a thank you. In other words, we want you digging and making knives...at the same time. While balancing a tea cup on your nose. And standing on one leg. While dressed as big bird. Well, maybe not the tea cup.

Scott, we'll have to get together after I get back and maybe drive up there together, split the cost of gas for the weekend. I don't know about you, but 12-16 mpg in the blazer adds up quick on a long trip.
Caveman
QUOTE (Dypheron @ Feb 1 2014, 09:02 AM) *
And you know I'll be up there helping this summer too Chris, I was already planning on getting a pump, no reason why I couldn't let you break it in up there... Seriously though, you're cool enough to extend the offer to prospect on your claim, no reason to not help you out as a thank you. In other words, we want you digging and making knives...at the same time. While balancing a tea cup on your nose. And standing on one leg. While dressed as big bird. Well, maybe not the tea cup.

Scott, we'll have to get together after I get back and maybe drive up there together, split the cost of gas for the weekend. I don't know about you, but 12-16 mpg in the blazer adds up quick on a long trip.



Right there with ya! I was hoping for that. I will let you know.
Crusty
QUOTE (Dypheron @ Feb 1 2014, 09:02 AM) *
Scott, we'll have to get together after I get back and maybe drive up there together, split the cost of gas for the weekend. I don't know about you, but 12-16 mpg in the blazer adds up quick on a long trip.


If y'all got room for a third, I'd love to come help out!

Caveman
I've got problem with that if Chris has no problem..... Might get kinda tight in the truck, though - equipment, 2 dogs, you, a caveman, and a fancy lad! smiley-cool14.gif

I'm sure there's room, though, if Brandon's willing to put the bagpipes in the back...... and leave his caber at home.
swizz
Brandon, I'm sitting here at the ranch licking my wounds from a really challenging day (by old guy standards) and your suggestion honestly had me laughing my arse off out loud in this quiet little cabin. The critters around the cabin are probably thinking I'm on something now. Hell, I was chatting it up with the birds this morning so they all know I'm a nut.
Of course Crusty is more than welcome at my claims! All CP Lifetime members are always welcome. You guys have 40 acres of awesomeness at your disposal with much virgin ground, hard work of course but that's mining. Sometimes not as hard as other times... gotta dig smart. emoticon-misc-004.gif
Dypheron
I may pick up a crew cab truck when I get home, assuming there's something decent up at Al Serra. That would solve the comfortable seating quite nicely I think, and still have plenty of room for gear.


I'm glad you got a good laugh out of it Chris, just because you were talking to the birds doesn't make you crazy. Now, if they start talking back...
Crusty
QUOTE (Caveman @ Feb 1 2014, 03:53 PM) *
I've got problem with that if Chris has no problem..... Might get kinda tight in the truck, though - equipment, 2 dogs, you, a caveman, and a fancy lad! smiley-cool14.gif I'm sure there's room, though, if Brandon's willing to put the bagpipes in the back...... and leave his caber at home.


I don't mind driving either, so I can always follow y'all in my Avalanche.

swizz
ok you goofballs, back to topic..... wink.gif

I'm still in the process of making that sheath and will update.
Meanwhile, I'm working on a quick and fun side project for my taxidermist friend.
I can't shape steel again until I get that 2X72 belt grinder but he wanted this knife so he bought the knife blank and just needs for me to create a handle and sheath. This is a small knife but he says he prefers to quickly dismantle Elk and Bear with this exact knife. The blank is made by Indian River Trading Company, stainless. He said that he wanted an orange/black handle so that it would be easier to deal with when slopped up with hide, fat, blood, etc.
As a note of interest, since I am only fabricating/attaching a handle to a pre-made blade with this project I am not a "Maker" of this knife. The proper term would be "Cutler". A Cutler is not a Knifemaker by technical standards... a Cutler is someone who attaches handles to knives. I am indeed a "Maker"... just not on this little side project. Being a skilled Cutler is prerequisite to Knifemaking.
fenixsmom
I mean to not step on your toes by suggesting this, but what about an ergonomic, nubby, firm gel-ish handle? Hand fatigue and no grip make gutting difficult. My huband does a "boneless quartering" technique that leaves all the skin, bones, innarss and hide behind. He says that his hands get cold and crampy while doing his thing. He uses this scalpel looking knife with replaceable blades and a weak hilt (? Handle). So I imagine the lack of a handle is what's causing issues.
Just being nosey sorry!
swizz
Good questions. There are disadvantages to using soft handle materials. Specifically durability, extreme temperature/environment tolerance, chemical resistance, and longevity.
When a good maker or cutler releases a knife or sword to the world he or she wants it to last for well over 100yrs... and that means even if it were lost in the woods or a river for many years. It needs to survive the test of time and abuse long after the maker is gone.
So... with that in mind I prefer to use very rigid and stable materials for my works and can shape them to any ergonomic preference. I like organic materials like wood, bone, and hopefully minerals once I get established but not opposed to good synthetics designed for knifemaking like G-10, Micarta, or Carbon Fiber. I do not like plastics, plastic/gem composites (although some composites are very good), or rubber... that's for the cheap disposable cutlery that factories crank out. Any maker worth their salt uses high grade materials for handles.
Here's a link to one of my supplier's list of handle materials, some are pre-textured for grip but I can texture about anything: Jantz Handle Material
fenixsmom
Good point. I Never considered durability and longevity.
swizz
QUOTE (fenixsmom @ Feb 3 2014, 06:21 PM) *
Hand fatigue and no grip make gutting difficult. My husband does a "boneless quartering" technique that leaves all the skin, bones, innards and hide behind. He says that his hands get cold and crampy while doing his thing.

In this case I would recommend a handle design similar to the Damascus Arctic Hunter (pg. 12) that I pictured recently in this thread (same one I'm making a sheath for now). That's a hunter/skinner designed with an oversized ergonomic handle and the finger grips are intentionally set further apart so that it is most useful while wearing gloves and field dressing a Caribou during an arctic blizzard. It's more comfortable to grip when wearing gloves, very firm in the hand. Feels too big and less comfortable without gloves.
I'm not suggesting that "blade" shape for him but giving an example of the oversized handle designed for cold/wet conditions when wearing gloves is practical while field dressing. I don't think that any "knife companies" sell anything specifically made to be used with gloves but I could be wrong on that.
swizz
QUOTE (fenixsmom @ Feb 4 2014, 10:12 AM) *
Good point. I Never considered durability and longevity.

I have a good example of that which I'm also working on.
This is an old Bowie (at least 50yrs) made by Solingen, a German company. A friend bought it at a garage sale for 5 or 10 bucks. In that condition it isn't worth anything more than that.
Judging by the condition I would say that this one has been exposed to water or corrosives for a long period of time, maybe lost in the woods. The steel is deeply pitted... however, I was very surprised to note that it is still very sharp and appears to have never been sharpened. This tells me that it is very good German steel. Worth restoring? Probably not, but I can't stand to throw things away and it'll be a fun project. The broken handle is plastic... fake bone, junk! The tiny guard is brass, as is the pommel screw, both useless. The original pommel (end cap) is missing. The black and white spacer material is plastic, junk! So ya, even though this is what I would consider excellent steel, they used garbage mass production materials and the handle assembly eventually broke apart.
The fist with three arrows is an awesome maker's mark though.
I have some ideas for it though and will resurrect it like a fiery Phoenix! It will live again, it deserves to.







fenixsmom
I think it would be a great restoration project! Can't waste good steel!
fenixsmom
Just a fyi: your knife was made around the 1950s by a company called PIC precision international corporation. They where from Solagin (?) Germany
fenixsmom
The tang stamp helped me find it thumbsupsmileyanim.gif
swizz
Interesting, how was PIC affiliated with Solingen?
swizz
QUOTE (fenixsmom @ Feb 4 2014, 11:20 AM) *
The tang stamp helped me find it thumbsupsmileyanim.gif

no, the "tang" is what the handle goes on. That stamp is on the "ricasso".
Knife Anatomy
fenixsmom
They came from the town of Solingen
fenixsmom
Oh, other people in knife forums referred to them as tang stamps. :) I'm researching on the fly!
swizz
There are stamps on the "tang" also.... I cleaned up the steel a little. Not sure of what significance those numbers are.
I knew about the town of Solingen, known for knifemaking. Too bad the world introduced them to plastic, lol.

fenixsmom
The 6 is.the handle type to be used, synthetic bone in your case and the 21 is the pattern to be used.
swizz
damn, you're good! research.gif
swizz
I had posted this on my fav knifemaking forum a while back and didn't get this much information. thumbsupsmileyanim.gif
fenixsmom
Just internet savvy. laurel_and_hardy.gif
OklaPony
Seems like it could be a lot newer than 50 years. One of the ways we date German musical instruments (usually violins, violas, and such) is whether or not the country of manufacture is listed with or with out W. or West preceding Germany. Pre WWII will not have such an identifier and neither will post 1989-ish pieces but anything in between will always have such a mark. The presence of plastics I think would most likely point it to post 1989 as opposed to pre WWII.

Is it possible the plastic is actually celluloid?

And, since I really don't know a damn thing about the history of German cutlery, are there known examples of pre WWII blades whose markings behave in a similar fashion to what I've outlined?
Dypheron
QUOTE (fenixsmom @ Feb 4 2014, 11:45 AM) *
Just internet savvy. laurel_and_hardy.gif


Watch out using those fancy smileys around Chris, next thing you know he'll be giving you a ridiculous name and calling you fancy lass. smiley-laughing021.gif
fenixsmom
"Lil' Miss Fancy Pants" haha!
fenixsmom
QUOTE (OklaPony @ Feb 6 2014, 10:28 AM) *
Seems like it could be a lot newer than 50 years. One of the ways we date German musical instruments (usually violins, violas, and such) is whether or not the country of manufacture is listed with or with out W. or West preceding Germany. Pre WWII will not have such an identifier and neither will post 1989-ish pieces but anything in between will always have such a mark. The presence of plastics I think would most likely point it to post 1989 as opposed to pre WWII.

Is it possible the plastic is actually celluloid?

And, since I really don't know a damn thing about the history of German cutlery, are there known examples of pre WWII blades whose markings behave in a similar fashion to what I've outlined?

P.I.C was bought out by another company later in its years, sone swiss company I think. I'll have to research it's history. It's a great possibility that they retained their tang stamp post buy out. I'll research and let you know!
fenixsmom
Well I was completely wrong! (It's been known to happen!) The knife was made on the 50s. It was made by the Solingen knife company. Here's some info on the company. http://sharky-fourbees.blogspot.com/2011/0...ermany.html?m=1. The tang stamp is conflicting though. That knife of yours is worth $500+ in good condition it isn't plastic, it's stag antler, which makes sense.
swizz
Oh, it's definitely fake antler... doesn't even look real. I melted it with a lighter, standard hard plastic.
The guy didn't specify how he wanted me to resto-mod it. He knows nothing about knives and said something like "whatever you think will work best".
I'm going to install a stacked-leather handle with brass guard and brass pommel. I'll make a sheath for it too.
If he doesn't barter or pay accordingly I'll keep it. It'll always have that pitted metal patina but still worthy of hard use. Good looking Bowie profile in my opinion.
But no, I don't think it's valuable as a vintage collectible per se, regardless the condition. Close but no cigar. groucho.gif
My guess would be 1950s or 60s.
fenixsmom
Well you know better than I! Good luck with the restoration!
Caveman
Chris, that knife is going to look really good after you are done with it. If the customer doesn't come through with the trade or cash, I would like to work out something with
you for it. Let me know if you are interested.....
swizz
The Solingen Bowie?
Caveman
Yes - I do not currently own a Bowie, and that old, pitted, and with a leather grip suits my style.....
swizz
QUOTE (Caveman @ Feb 6 2014, 06:49 PM) *
Yes - I do not currently own a Bowie, and that old, pitted, and with a leather grip suits my style.....

Ha, I'm right with you there. I've never had a Bowie either and the patina is kinda cool. I'll keep you in mind for sure Scott.
That one's still on the back burner. Today I got caught up on that Arctic Hunter sheath and might finish it tomorrow if I have time.
I also made myself a belt from some thick Sherman Oak leather. It's 10oz thick and 1.5" wide. I put a big ass shiny buckle on it so I can finally get that cowgirl I've always wanted.
I was pricing heavy duty belts similar to this last year at around $70-$100. I made this one for less than $20 with my wholesale pricing and (dare I say) it's better quality than what I was looking at, even the Duluth Trading Company belts. No fancy stamping on this, pure function.
Anyway, this one will be nice to hang the pea shooter from. char092.gif
traddoerr
Chris, my son and I have been following your knife making thread from the begining, we to are puting to gether a knife for him and I, but we have purchased the blades ourselves that are already made, just need sharpening. this has been one of the most informative threads to follow, thanks, when we get to a couple points we will post what we have done if you don't mind, and will need your advise on some of the processes to finishing a blade. thumbsupsmileyanim.gif
swizz
That is awesome! thumbsupsmileyanim.gif You guys are really going to cherish those when you're done.
Yes, by all means... ask away if you have any questions. I'm glad to help if I can.
Crusty
QUOTE (swizz @ Feb 4 2014, 11:02 AM) *
I have a good example of that which I'm also working on.



That'll make a pretty sweet utility blade! Bad thing about having a pretty new knife is you're afraid to ding it up, so that one would get a lot of use! Can't wait to see what you do with it!
Caveman
Awesome belt, Chris! Have you tried/thought about making holsters yet? If so, you have a customer!
swizz
QUOTE (Caveman @ Feb 7 2014, 10:30 AM) *
Awesome belt, Chris! Have you tried/thought about making holsters yet? If so, you have a customer!

Yes! I currently have pancake-holster patterns for Glock, Springfield XD, Smith & Wesson M&P, Kahr 9, and 1911 styles.
It's also on the back burner but I'd like to make a holster for my Glock by springtime. I might have to buy 'blue guns' (plastic replicas) for form-fitting purposes though.
Crusty
QUOTE (swizz @ Feb 7 2014, 11:29 AM) *
Yes! I currently have pancake-holster patterns for Glock, Springfield XD, Smith & Wesson M&P, Kahr 9, and 1911 styles.
It's also on the back burner but I'd like to make a holster for my Glock by springtime. I might have to buy 'blue guns' (plastic replicas) for form-fitting purposes though.



Sounds like you need to take up cloning, so you get get all that stuff off the back burner! ;)
swizz
LOL, nah that wouldn't be any fun.
Not happy unless all burners are on full blast.
fenixsmom
Hey Chris, I've heard that you can use a belt to sharpen your knives. I have a cheapo V sharpener that shaves quite a bit bit of metal off with every sharpening. I know the stick sharpener is preferable for home use, but I'm looking for an alternative to recutting the edge every time I need to sharpen..
Caveman
Stone and ceramics are best for sharpening, diamond stones for mass metal removal or touch up (depending on coarseness) and steel for touch up w/o removing metal.

Chris - how about a western holster?
swizz
QUOTE (Caveman @ Feb 7 2014, 05:28 PM) *
Chris - how about a western holster?

That's out of my league for now... really a lot of things to learn before I can tackle westerns.
As far as sharpening, I'm not an expert on that. If I need to redefine a cutting edge I use three separate flat sharpening stones - coarse, medium, and a fine Arkansas honing stone. Once that edge is established I fine tune it with a standard sharpening steel. The next step is leather strop but I don't have one.
90% of the time I go right for the sharpening steel to touch up an edge, works great. I don't have any experience with the diamond products or v-rods.
fenixsmom
I have a carbide sharpener I do believe. My glass (doh!) Cutting board kills my knife. Fortunately it's not an expensive blade to begin with. It'll just be good info for when I have a nicer set up.
Dypheron
QUOTE (swizz @ Feb 4 2014, 11:44 AM) *
I had posted this on my fav knifemaking forum a while back and didn't get this much information. thumbsupsmileyanim.gif


I came across that thread today actually, was reading a thread about something else and decided to poke around. Small world.
Denise
Your projects are coming along great Chris!! Looks like its kicking into high gear. thumbsupsmileyanim.gif There will be no stopping you when you get the rest of the equipment needed. emoticon-object-009.gif
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