Mrs. CP,

What setup would you suggest for someone who would like to cab from rough rock to finished product? I would like to start out somewhere in the middle price wise, under 2K What do you think of combo units, brand names, etc...

Thx for your help,
G_B
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Hi GB,
Great picture! You have a good eye for photography.

Good to see your interested in lapidary work. Have to do something with all the goodies we find right.
I think if your going to get into working rocks, you might as well get the right equipment that can handle most of the rock you collect.
I personally dont like the combo units (trim saw and grinding unit), the trim saw that comes with them is a bit small for some of the trimming work we do.

First we use our 8-10" Lortone with clock fed vise to cut/slab rough pieces. Ours runs a very stiff 8" blade and this size saw is referred to as a trim saw still, but it can be used to slab rough in the proper size ranges so the blade isn't over loaded and forced to drift around causing wavey cutting.

After slabbing the rough, we use one of our smaller saws (6" or 4") to trim out the cab blanks or preshapes that will be dopped to sticks and cabbed.

From there we take the cabochon to the speed demon diamond cabber (older machine, no longer being made).......this is a 6" drum grinding machine with 4 different drums/grits and a flat polishing pad on the right hand side.
There are several machines made today that use the drum sets and they are also made in 8" sizes for larger work.
Cabbing machines made today are quite similar and can be found by several companies.
Some do not come with the diamond carbide rougher wheels though and we would recommend getting those too. They will cost alot more than silicon carbide but the diamond carbides will last and last without changing shape/wear down as the silicon carbide does.

So, you will need a saw for slabbing rough 8"-10" at least with a vise and feed set (clock motor or gravity fed). They come in much larger sizes if ever needed too but those are very pricey.
You will also need a smaller saw for the trim work on blanks.........4" or 6" will work well for this.
Then the cabbing machine unit..... 6" we recommend, and you can get 4 or 6 drum set ups depending on what you wish to spend.

Here are a few links to browse through for machines of this type. You can also find these units used at a decent price sometimes.
The Denver Gem and Mineral show might be a good time/place to look for one used. That show is coming up in a week or so and is posted in the forum's calendar.

Diamond Pacific lapidary equipment

Covington lapidary equipment

Lortone lapidary equipment

We would recommend against one of the tiny combo units. Just to small and won't make you happy if you are getting into cabbing and wish to continue. Most combos are ok starters, but people quickly wish they had something more if they keep working in the lapidary arts.


Dan is the one here who maintains and does the slabbing on the larger saw. I call him my slab it man.
He has using that thing down to a T! Good luck with the new adventure, and always feel free to ask any questions.


Denise

Great info. I can see keeping it under 2K is a tough job...I found a 10" slab/trim from Covington with power feed. Is the 10" too excessive for trimming? It sure would save alot of dough. I could only find this saw thru DadsRockShop.com. It was not available at Covington's web site. All your help is greatly appreciated.
Thx, G_B
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It is tough to start off under 2k, but well worth the money I think. Beats wanting to upgrade to better units later like some I have seen getting into lapidary work. The 10" Covington slab saw would be too big for trimming slabs, but a very good unit for slabbing! When it comes to trimming slabs, you will definately want a smaller saw though. 4" or 6 " would be better for that task.

Fantastic picture! You would really like the Photography section of the forum also. I post lots in there.

Can you explain why it would be to big. thx much

I thought I might throw in my two cents here Denise. Hope you don't mind.
I have a 10 inch slab saw. When it comes to trimming a slab for cabbing you would want a smaller bladed saw. The bigger your saw is the wider the kerf. the kerf is the cut width or slightly wider than the blade. When dealing with a slab you really need a blade that makes a thinner kerf.A wider blade tends to take out chips and cause fracturing in smaller pieces. The smaller blades also have finer diamond in them which help reduce chipping and chance for fractures. Also using a smaller saw allows for much more control. Most bigger saws are designed to be ran with the cover down on them anyway.
Another concideration is safety. If you ever get a piece of stone snatched from your hand and flung across the room you will understand. Or even worse one come apart. There is alot of power stored up in a 10 inch blade moving at a high rpm. The covers are not just to keep splash down.
I wish you luck on you new obsession. And yes that's what it is. Have fun.

Good input Jim thanks, no we don't mind at all.

Like Denise said G_B, you will want a smaller 6" or 4" for the cab blank trimming. We very rarely use the larger saw free hand and never to trim cab blanks, as Jim pointed out, it's moving very fast with alot more power than a smaller saw. A 10" saw being a "trim" saw is a designation from the manufactures, not sure why, maybe cabinet size mineral specimens that need trimmed?
Another big difference from the 10" saw with a vise to a smaller 4" or 6" saw is a table on both sides of the blade, along with the smaller less aggressive blade and motor.
Lapcraft makes a L'il Trimmer 4" saw with a tub for coolant. The blade that comes with it may not be the best quality but you can get some very decent blades that will last quite a long time for these.
With one of these you can trim out the preshape cab blanks marked out on those slabs from the 10" Having the table on both sides of the blade you can then keep your slab flat while cutting, that would be near impossible with the larger vise saws.

Hope this explains it a bit more but keep the q's coming if needed, we are all glad to help around here.


CP

All of that makes perfect sense. Thanks for helping me out. I'll have plenty more questions to come and I can take comfort that 'use guys' will be there.
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G_B

GB i hope that rainbow stopped right over your home!

Nice pic, yep hopefully right over the house like Russ said. That's where I find my pot o' gold too!

Forgot to add these links in the other night while posting.......a couple short videos that you can see both the larger 8" and the smaller 6" saws in use while we cut open a few thunder eggs.
In ThunderEgg Cutting 3, both saws are used in this video demo and then again the larger saw with vise in ThunderEgg Cutting 2 while cutting a dandy Oregon double.

Careful though, watching these may spike the rock fever when that first look at what's inside shows up!


I've gone ahead and moved this whole thread on over to the equipment section, good saw information for all the lapidary enthusiasts.

CP

very interesting video. what are the costs of a new diamond blade in larger diameters?what speed does this saw or any saw run? the coolant for this blade needs to not only lube the blade but cool it aswell. what do you use for coolant? you posted it before but i forgot.i see this saw is limited to what ever can be clamped into the vice. i wonder if a saw could be made to be more versital by changing to a bigger blade and a bigger vise. i know i could build one of these but im reluctant todo so! also i was told that i could use the JR. colleges saw to cut whatever i want, but was advized that their saw cuts are not very good. what would cause this? a bent/bad blade/unsecured vise??we have a 12 inch fosselized tree base that my wife was given by her dad.we saw a show where they slabbed up some of this type of material, and depending on the colors and quility of cut/polish, it was worth a lot of money.im thinking of cutting a few slabs if i get the ok from the boss. i dont want to do ANY substandard cuts making this a waste of time and material.wodja think?

Thanks Russ, glad you enjoyed them.

A 12" pet wood base, that sounds really cool. Love to see some pics of that, especially when you get to cut it....that is, if the boss say's ok. Sounds like you'll need a 24" saw to cut that piece or possibly it could be cut in an 18" depending on the shape and vise clamped orientation of the stone.
Definately don't want to have any substandard cuts on a nice pet wood piece.

Larger diameters? How big? Some saws are 48", those blades are around 5k and up.
8-10" blades can run from around $50 to about $100 depending on brand, style and quality. Once in great while you can get lucky and find a no name blade for 20 bucks or less, but not often. Some of the smaller blades (4-6") are much less costly but again, prices vary with style, brand, quality.

For coolants we use several different ones.......On the smallest saw (4") we just use a soap and water combo which we then empty every use to prevent rusting on the blade.
The 6" saw we like to use kerosene in, it's rpm's are a bit faster (homemade set up) and the kero works very well as a coolant with very easy clean up.
For the 8-10" saw we are now using RV antifreeze with a touch of soap. Previously we've used almag oil which is for rock cutting but it's also toxic, very messy and hard to clean off the rocks and saw. The RV antifreeze has been working well for us, it just needs to have a bit added once in a while because of evaporation. Cheap, easy to find and it's non toxic.

RPM's on diamond blades are ideal at about 1800 to 2200, faster and the heat builds too quickly which will just peel the diamond carbide nickel plating off.
Haven't heard of the JR saw you refered to but there are several things that could cause bad cuts. Bent or bad blades for sure as well as loose vise set that lets the stone come loose. Also, if the vise itself and it's platform/slides are loose or sloppy that will cause a waves in the cut. Blades that are too thin kerf for size stone being cut will also cause waves, even with a brand new blade. Another factor can be the stone itself, sometimes the rock will let go of it's cut and let the blade "push" outward, this is usually caused by a fracture in the stone that just lets go during the cut.

With a good blade, a solid stone, and everything running just right, I can get a slab to 1mm consistently across the cut and very straight. This is extremely hard to do and somedays seems impossible, but with some practice and patients it can be done.

CP

Dan the JR i was refering to is the "Junior College" its their saw of a unknown brand.

Oh ok, I gotcha. My bad, I wasn't reading it right.
Hopefully this info helps get that saw on a better cut routine then.
Thought I'd add our kerf thickness on the 8" blade for reference here too....... it's a nice stiff blade (.080) which works well for stuff like agates, chalcedony (pet woods ), jade etc. and really helps get those thin slices consistently down to the 1-3 mm thicknesses for the stone guitar picks.

Thanks for clearing that up Russ, was so busy answering q's I just figured that was a brand I hadn't heard of yet.

CP

thanks for your info on this type of equipment. im not sure if ill get into lap work but if my ole bones keep yelling at me i might have to!

I love doing lapidary art! The first few cabs I did, I was quite surprised at the sore muscles I had after.
Muscles I didnt use as much I guess.
It definately uses muscles in your hands, wrists, arms, back and legs......Depending on if you stand at the cab machine or sit.
I like to have the machine setup high enough to stand at while I work. I crank up the music, and go with the flow.
Careful if using this technigue with music .....You may end up with lumpy cabs.

If you ever do decide to dable in the lapidary world Russ, I would love to see your work!
Bet your wife would love to see/have some too.

Gold Barnstormer, what kind of lapidary equipment set up did you end up getting?
Inquiring minds want to know after seeing those beautiful cabochons your making.........

I purchased the Inland SwapTop 8" Flat Lap with the conversion top for the saw. Although the majority of my cutting has been done with a really nice Covington 8" with power feed...........Ignore said dirty saw.......I use 80 175 325 600 and 1200 grit wheels. I'm still not dopping and have had great success with the horizontal style.
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