ColoradoProspector   CP Club Membership Info.

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

3 Pages V   1 2 3 >  
Reply to this topicStart new topic
Montezuma's Treasure Vault?, Stone Ruins Discovered While Prospecting
ASTROBLEME
post Jan 24 2015, 12:43 PM
Post #1


Rock Bar!
****

Group: Members
Posts: 480
Joined: 16-October 08
From: Central Colorado
Member No.: 6,813



My wife and I discovered an ancient stone ruins site while prospecting for gold back in 2013.

The site consists of three structures that are constructed onto the natural steep slope of the side of a dry arroyo leading down to a river a few miles away. A query to U.S. Department of Interior returns no knowledge of any previous investigation or other documentation of this site.

My first impression was that it may have been a mining or homestead site, a kiln or storage area in the shelter of the arroyo. After looking it over closely, it was apparent that it was built long ago due to the 10 foot depth of erosion observed from the base of the structures to the present bottom of the channel. There isnít a historic wagon road or trail to the site. There is no near source of water. It appeared to me to resemble the cliff dwellings in SW Colorado more than anything else Iíve seen.

The largest of the ruins is a round structure of crude unshaped natural stone blocks, essentially forming a tower with a solid flat top. The mortar material of the 'tower' and the smaller rectangular structures nearby appears to be a kind of course cement made up of pebbles and gravel found locally. The possible ceremonial aspect that gets my attention is the platform at the base that points towards a notch in the horizon at 245 degree (m), the near angle of the summer solstice sunset. There is a possibility that the tower covers an underground tunnel dug into the soft siltstone-shale that forms the bank of the arroyo. The structures might have been covered over after being built by simply pushing down the steep slope some of the fill and alluvial materials found uphill of the ruins.

There is still much to be learned at this site and I would appreciate any ideas that you might have. Presently, I am looking into the possibility that these stone ruins may have been constructed by one of the 7 caravans that traveled north with Montezumaís Aztec Treasure. For sure, the Conquistadors were present in this area spanning many decades after Cortezís activity in present day Mexico.

Attached Image


--------------------
Annual Dues Paying Member Since 2008

Tonko Mining Company

"Some day this crater is going to be a greatly talked about place, and if the above credit is due, as is certainly the case, I would like to have it generally known for the sake of the children." Daniel Moreau Barringer 2/1/1912 in a letter about the Barringer Meteorite Crater, Arizona USA
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
fenixsmom
post Jan 24 2015, 01:08 PM
Post #2


Master Mucker!
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 1,282
Joined: 13-January 14
From: Lakewood, Colorado
Member No.: 116,305



That is so freaking cool!
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
fenixsmom
post Jan 24 2015, 01:12 PM
Post #3


Master Mucker!
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 1,282
Joined: 13-January 14
From: Lakewood, Colorado
Member No.: 116,305



Lol I was going to show off my lil archaeological dig site, but yours is SO much more interesting! thumbsupsmileyanim.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
CP
post Jan 24 2015, 01:38 PM
Post #4


Master Mucker!
*****

Group: Admin
Posts: 4,136
Joined: 7-October 03
From: Colorado
Member No.: 3



Very cool find you two! thumbsupsmileyanim.gif It will be very exciting to see if it is a tunnel behind that. Sorry but I don't have any more info historically to offer on it. Looking forward to updates for sure, awesome find!
signs021.gif


--------------------
CP-Owner/Administrator
www.ColoradoProspector.com

IF YOU USE IT, THE GROUND PRODUCED IT!
MINERS MAKE "IT" HAPPEN!!


Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
fenixsmom
post Jan 24 2015, 01:49 PM
Post #5


Master Mucker!
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 1,282
Joined: 13-January 14
From: Lakewood, Colorado
Member No.: 116,305



Is there any sort of mortar in-between the cobbles? It almost looks like the ruins of the late 19th or 20th centuries. However on a small screen it's hard to tell.

Edit: just noticed you answered the question I posed already. Sorry about that.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ASTROBLEME
post Jan 24 2015, 02:21 PM
Post #6


Rock Bar!
****

Group: Members
Posts: 480
Joined: 16-October 08
From: Central Colorado
Member No.: 6,813



Here's a pic looking down channel. This gives you a better idea as to the depth of erosion and how the structures seem to be "heading underground".

Attached Image


--------------------
Annual Dues Paying Member Since 2008

Tonko Mining Company

"Some day this crater is going to be a greatly talked about place, and if the above credit is due, as is certainly the case, I would like to have it generally known for the sake of the children." Daniel Moreau Barringer 2/1/1912 in a letter about the Barringer Meteorite Crater, Arizona USA
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Crusty
post Jan 24 2015, 02:37 PM
Post #7


Master Mucker!
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,312
Joined: 6-June 13
From: Falcon, CO
Member No.: 82,915



What an amazing find! Goes to show how much cool stuff there is out there left to discover!


--------------------
Find Colorado Prospector on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/170314493176558

CP Lifetime Member

Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ASTROBLEME
post Jan 24 2015, 02:38 PM
Post #8


Rock Bar!
****

Group: Members
Posts: 480
Joined: 16-October 08
From: Central Colorado
Member No.: 6,813



The source for the mortar is in the near vicinity. The builders dug under a cemented bed of gravels and took out suitable limestone for making the mortar. You can see the gray limestone form a seam almost looking like a vein in the "blurry" pic ...sorry about the blur but it was dark inside and I was on my belly trying to avoid snakes!"

Attached Image



Attached Image



--------------------
Annual Dues Paying Member Since 2008

Tonko Mining Company

"Some day this crater is going to be a greatly talked about place, and if the above credit is due, as is certainly the case, I would like to have it generally known for the sake of the children." Daniel Moreau Barringer 2/1/1912 in a letter about the Barringer Meteorite Crater, Arizona USA
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ASTROBLEME
post Jan 24 2015, 02:57 PM
Post #9


Rock Bar!
****

Group: Members
Posts: 480
Joined: 16-October 08
From: Central Colorado
Member No.: 6,813



QUOTE (fenixsmom @ Jan 24 2015, 01:49 PM) *
Is there any sort of mortar in-between the cobbles? It almost looks like the ruins of the late 19th or 20th centuries. However on a small screen it's hard to tell.

Edit: just noticed you answered the question I posed already. Sorry about that.


The mortar resembles a very poor concrete. Interestingly, there are pieces of wood charcoal that has been preserved in some of the fillings. The calcium has really diffused out of the mortar and coats everything it touches. Keeping in mind that this is an arid environment, rain and snow over time has caused the calcium to seep out onto the stone below the filling in the pic below.

Attached Image




--------------------
Annual Dues Paying Member Since 2008

Tonko Mining Company

"Some day this crater is going to be a greatly talked about place, and if the above credit is due, as is certainly the case, I would like to have it generally known for the sake of the children." Daniel Moreau Barringer 2/1/1912 in a letter about the Barringer Meteorite Crater, Arizona USA
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ASTROBLEME
post Jan 24 2015, 03:08 PM
Post #10


Rock Bar!
****

Group: Members
Posts: 480
Joined: 16-October 08
From: Central Colorado
Member No.: 6,813



To give you an idea as to the size/scale of the structures, here is a pic of my archaeologist friend during a site visit. He is standing on the top of the "tower" structure collecting some survey data.

Attached Image






--------------------
Annual Dues Paying Member Since 2008

Tonko Mining Company

"Some day this crater is going to be a greatly talked about place, and if the above credit is due, as is certainly the case, I would like to have it generally known for the sake of the children." Daniel Moreau Barringer 2/1/1912 in a letter about the Barringer Meteorite Crater, Arizona USA
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Rockyrat
post Jan 24 2015, 03:32 PM
Post #11


Shovel Buster!
***

Group: Members
Posts: 65
Joined: 28-August 14
From: Colorado Springs, CO
Member No.: 118,061



First off this is very cool. I originally came across the CP forums because I was researching lost treasures. I do have a couple of questions.

1) What do the numbers and arrows in the second picture represent?

2) In the first picture it almost looks like there's a small opening near the bottom of the wall behind the dead bush. It also looks like the opening is behind the small outcropping seen in the second picture. Is it an opening? To me it almost looks like a primitive grain silo.

3) I can see several old cans in the pictures. Did you inspect any of them for clues?

4) Do you have more pictures?


--------------------
I'm never lost. I'm always directly above the center of the Earth.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ASTROBLEME
post Jan 24 2015, 04:38 PM
Post #12


Rock Bar!
****

Group: Members
Posts: 480
Joined: 16-October 08
From: Central Colorado
Member No.: 6,813



QUOTE (Rockyrat @ Jan 24 2015, 03:32 PM) *
First off this is very cool. I originally came across the CP forums because I was researching lost treasures. I do have a couple of questions.

1) What do the numbers and arrows in the second picture represent?

2) In the first picture it almost looks like there's a small opening near the bottom of the wall behind the dead bush. It also looks like the opening is behind the small outcropping seen in the second picture. Is it an opening? To me it almost looks like a primitive grain silo.

3) I can see several old cans in the pictures. Did you inspect any of them for clues?

4) Do you have more pictures?


Hello Rockyrat and welcome to the CP Forums. Hopefully you will find lots of helpful information. Here's the answers you requested;

1) The arrows were added by me in an early photo I took of the site just to give each structure a number as research began and information was being sent out to those who were assisting me. The Tower is #1, #2 is behind a rock wall and not visible from that angle and #3 is the low-walled narrow structure furthest from the tower.
2) There is an opening right behind the "platform" at the base of the tower. It is sealed off except for an animal burrow. My archaeologist friend dismissed grain storage right away when he made a site visit.
3) The old cans are nothing more than trash that is the result of more modern peoples using the vicinity arroyos for their trash disposal. Some cans came downhill but most arrived from further upchannel during flood events.
4) I've placed a photo below of the opening behind the platform on the base of the tower and what is curious, to me at least, is the orientation of some stones changes from horizontal to vertical. They look pretty unstable and could be a trap set to cave in on someone trying to dig into the tower...

Attached Image


--------------------
Annual Dues Paying Member Since 2008

Tonko Mining Company

"Some day this crater is going to be a greatly talked about place, and if the above credit is due, as is certainly the case, I would like to have it generally known for the sake of the children." Daniel Moreau Barringer 2/1/1912 in a letter about the Barringer Meteorite Crater, Arizona USA
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
ASTROBLEME
post Jan 24 2015, 06:38 PM
Post #13


Rock Bar!
****

Group: Members
Posts: 480
Joined: 16-October 08
From: Central Colorado
Member No.: 6,813



Dear Treasure Seekers,

You may know something about "mounds" that I am not aware of since my focus is primarily geology and the mineral values that are in place due to natural forces. If you have expertise in mounds & mound builders, I would like your opinions on this Stone Ruins Site.

Last summer I realized that an interesting geological feature at the site looked much like an ancient mound. This mound appears to me to be the result of the builders disposing of material from an excavation. As I look at it, the mound is a lot like a conical pile of gravel deposited from the back of a large dredge. But keep in mind that this site is in an area that is very dry and arid and no gold dredging ever took place here.

At this point in the research effort, my opinion is that the mound in the photos below, is the result of a non-natural deposition. I am currently thinking that the conical pile covers another stone ruins structure. The faulting and folding of the limestone, siltstone and shale at this site allows for easy excavation, by hand or primitive tools, into an extensive layer of soft deposits along the bank of the arroyo. The builders of the stone ruins could have hidden the structures by covering them with easily accessible materials. I think there is a good possibility of an extensive tunnel system in this area due to the fact that the surface of the mound is rounded rocks while the surroundings are limestone,shale and ancient inland sea deposits!

Do you have any thoughts about the cone shaped mound top and the rocks placed upon it? What are your ideas as to how this pile of "rounded gravels" could form form a mound so close to the stone ruins?

If you would like to get involved with this effort...please let me know what your expertise is and how you could assist.

ASTROBLEME

MOUND TOP
Attached Image


MOUND VIEW

Attached Image


--------------------
Annual Dues Paying Member Since 2008

Tonko Mining Company

"Some day this crater is going to be a greatly talked about place, and if the above credit is due, as is certainly the case, I would like to have it generally known for the sake of the children." Daniel Moreau Barringer 2/1/1912 in a letter about the Barringer Meteorite Crater, Arizona USA
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
RhodoRose
post Jan 25 2015, 08:00 AM
Post #14


Shovel Buster!
***

Group: Members
Posts: 71
Joined: 2-July 13
From: Colorado Springs
Member No.: 86,914



'Morning!

My interest in archeology used to be (!) far greater than my interest in prospecting, and CP members are no dummies; but let me state the obvious, for the record: be very, very careful not to tamper with sites which are obviously man-made. Antiquities Act laws are as harsh and unforgiving as prospecting laws, and the federal gov't is really nasty about prosecuting anyone messing with what they deem an important site, before or after someone's touched it.

That said - Cool finds!

RhodoRose


Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
fenixsmom
post Jan 25 2015, 10:46 AM
Post #15


Master Mucker!
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 1,282
Joined: 13-January 14
From: Lakewood, Colorado
Member No.: 116,305



If I'm not mistaken, the only civilizations that have been in CO are the native Americans, the Mexicans, maybe the Spaniards, and white settlers. I would look for tools and markings on the stone. Large chips on the cut edge would suggest stone, smoother cuts would suggest steel or iron. Keep an eye for bone piles and pottery. I always wanted to be an archeologist smiley-chores016.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

3 Pages V   1 2 3 >
Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 



Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 25th November 2017 - 04:18 AM