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How do you determine when your disturbance becomes significant??
realnice
post Jul 28 2010, 10:49 AM
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Hi all, im new to the site. Been prospecting for about 10 years here in Colorado. I hold a few mining claims and am wondering about determining significant disturbance on historically disturbed areas. An area where i have a claim has been logged and mined for a long time and the land shows it. It also has very heavy 4wd use. it is not very pristine at all. One of my claims is visible from the road so recently it has come upon scrutiny by the USFS. there is a 40 ft x 20 ft. worked area. The area is disturbed and is comprised of filled in diggs.
The 228.4 Plan of operations—notice of intent—requirements seem to fit my site as to not have to file a plan of operations, but one stipulation is...
(v) Operations, which in their totality,
will not cause surface resource disturbance
which is substantially different
than that caused by other users
of the National Forest System who are
not required to obtain a Forest Service
special use authorization, contract, or
other written authorization;

If they deem my operation to be causing significant disturbance what can they do? Arent they supposed to inform me to stop and complete a plan of operations? What are my rights here?

How do I appeal a desicion by the USFS?






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Caveman
post Jul 12 2013, 03:37 PM
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Interesting...... there are mining claims there (where I'm looking), but they are all closed - not active, not refilled. She did say I could pan w/o any problems, but using any kind of mechanized requires a POO - even with no claim filed. I had thought that a POO could not be filed w/o a claim. I wonder if that applies to this particular ACEC in their minds - it has not been withdrawn from mining by the way, I asked specifically and she replied very quickly and assertively that it had not. It seems that they want to review what you want to do and charge a bond accordingly for restoration purposes. Grape Creek is an ACEC for archaeological reasons (Ute Temple). They do require that you fill out a NOI to run dredges, high bankers, power sluices, and trommels at Point Bar (hence the permit fee of $25 per type), but not for panning or stream sluices. If they are not allowed to do this per the Mining Law of 1872 and the Federal Land Policy and Management Act of 1976, then how are they getting away with it? Here are some of their Guidelines for the Royal Gorge Field Office (RFGO)...

Casual Use Activities

Casual Use means activities ordinarily resulting in no or negligible disturbance of the public lands or resources. Casual use generally includes the collection of geochemical, rock, soil or mineral specimens using hand tools; hand panning; or non-motorized sluicing. It may also include use of battery-operated devices for sensing the presence of minerals. Casual use does not include use of mechanized earth-moving equipment. See below for requirements specific to suction dredge operations.

Notification to the BLM is not required for casual use activities on public lands.

Recreational Placer Mining in the RGFO and along the Arkansas River corridor

Per 43CFR 8365.1-5: Except on developed recreation sites and areas (or where otherwise prohibited and posted) it is permissible to collect from the public lands reasonable amounts of rock and mineral specimens for noncommercial purposes. Motorized or mechanical devices, except metal detectors, may not be used to aid in the collection of rock and mineral specimens.

Over the Counter Notification : For notice level operations at the Point Bar Placer Area, the following thresholds apply:
•In stream (suction dredging) equipment is limited to 4-inch intake nozzle and 8 hp motors.
•On shore (high banking) equipment is limited to a 3-inch intake hose or nozzle and 8-hp in total motor size.
•Operations are permitted between April 1 and September 30

General Conditions of Use

Placer Activities
•Streamside (riparian) vegetation shall not be damaged by operations.
•Motorized vehicles are restricted to designated roads and parking areas and shall be kept at least 20 feet from the edge of the stream, and away from wet or muddy areas next to the stream, streamside vegetation, or wetlands.
•On shore excavation locations shall be refilled upon completion of work. If the operator leaves the area for more than a two-day period, this work must be completed prior to departure.
•All trash, debris, or other items that were brought to the area, shall be removed to an approved disposal site when work is completed.

Public Lands
•Control erosion and water runoff.
•Take measures to isolate, remove, or control toxic materials.
•Reshape and re-vegetate disturbed areas where reasonable and practicable.
•Rehabilitate fisheries and wildlife habitat where reasonable and practicable.
•Maintain equipment, and other facilities in a safe and orderly manner.
•Do not collect or disturb historic or archaeological resources or sites.
•All operations are required to comply with applicable state or federal regulations pertaining to threatened and endangered species.
•Unnecessary and undue degradation of public lands is not authorized.


And check the Causal Use Limitations in this document:

http://www.blm.gov/pgdata/etc/medialib/blm...Information.pdf


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Posts in this topic
- realnice   How do you determine when your disturbance becomes significant??   Jul 28 2010, 10:49 AM
- - ColoradoProspector   Hi realnice and welcome to the forums, we are al...   Jul 29 2010, 11:27 AM
- - realnice   I have a mining claim that was unfortunately shut ...   Nov 18 2010, 11:51 PM
|- - Mineral Estate Grantee   Folks, Realnice, The way the Forest Service sees i...   Nov 22 2010, 12:47 AM
|- - iowajoey   QUOTE (realnice @ Nov 18 2010, 11:51 PM) ...   Nov 23 2010, 08:11 PM
- - russau   if this is your legal federal mining claim, you DO...   Nov 21 2010, 06:47 AM
- - ColoradoProspector   Hi Realnice, Russ is correct, you completely have...   Nov 21 2010, 12:12 PM
- - Coalbunny   Title 18, Part I, Chapter 13 Civil Rights Sec. 24...   Nov 22 2010, 02:22 AM
|- - russau   it is a violation of federal law to stop/impede/in...   Nov 23 2010, 06:12 AM
|- - dickb   QUOTE (russau @ Nov 23 2010, 06:12 AM) it...   Nov 23 2010, 09:55 AM
- - ColoradoProspector   Hi Joey and welcome to the forums, I've never...   Nov 25 2010, 05:19 PM
- - realnice   Well, let me begin by saying thank you for all...   Nov 27 2010, 12:59 PM
|- - dickb   Hi realnice: I am still wondering if you have fil...   Nov 27 2010, 06:17 PM
- - realnice   QUOTE (realnice @ Nov 27 2010, 11:59 AM) ...   Nov 27 2010, 09:10 PM
|- - dickb   Hi Again realnice: If the BLM is solid behind you...   Nov 27 2010, 10:14 PM
- - ColoradoProspector   Pit size of 1600 sq ft pit can be (in Colorado) 5-...   Nov 28 2010, 10:43 AM
- - realnice   QUOTE (ColoradoProspector @ Jan 3 2007, 12...   Nov 28 2010, 12:01 PM
- - ColoradoProspector   Good work, that's the quote I was refering to ...   Nov 28 2010, 12:10 PM
- - realnice   Here's a document that I have on significant d...   Nov 28 2010, 01:35 PM
- - realnice   Ok y'all, (those who have read up on this thre...   Nov 30 2010, 06:21 PM
- - ColoradoProspector   Hi again realnice, Yes it is very sad when they d...   Dec 2 2010, 08:24 AM
- - realnice   So, I am finally piecing together my appeal and ho...   Dec 13 2010, 12:47 PM
- - ColoradoProspector   Good luck with it too when finished. I'm think...   Dec 15 2010, 01:12 PM
- - realnice   Well I found that quote I was looking for about n...   Dec 25 2010, 12:19 AM
- - russau   Good luck on your trip and Merry Christmass and Ha...   Dec 25 2010, 06:20 AM
- - Forestwalker   "weather or not the operator submits a NOI, t...   Jan 2 2011, 03:03 PM
- - realnice   Quick update: Got a call yesterday from a...   Jan 8 2011, 05:59 PM
- - ColoradoProspector   Hi realnice, Great work on your response and you ...   Jan 15 2011, 10:43 AM
- - realnice   Hola from Costa Rica.:) No info from the FS yet. ...   Feb 5 2011, 10:57 AM
- - realnice   While in Costa Rica I had a Fax of a F.S document ...   Mar 8 2011, 05:11 PM
- - amethystguy   This is almost a nail biting thread. Can't wa...   Mar 9 2011, 08:24 AM
|- - swizz   QUOTE (amethystguy @ Mar 9 2011, 07:24 AM...   Mar 9 2011, 08:47 AM
- - ColoradoProspector   QUOTE (swizz @ Mar 9 2011, 07:47 AM) Yes...   Mar 9 2011, 10:56 AM
|- - swizz   QUOTE (ColoradoProspector @ Mar 9 2011, 09...   Mar 9 2011, 09:13 PM
- - Mrs.CP   Haha! I about spit my drink on the computer af...   Mar 10 2011, 08:12 AM
|- - leonard   QUOTE (Mrs.CP @ Mar 10 2011, 07:12 AM) Ha...   Mar 11 2011, 06:23 PM
- - realnice   Haha! Bikini Car wash!.... I assume I...   Mar 10 2011, 11:10 AM
- - swizz   I'm going to stick with my classic one-piece b...   Mar 12 2011, 12:31 PM
- - realnice   Ok y'all. Here's a little stuff for you to...   Mar 25 2011, 03:38 PM
- - ColoradoProspector   Interesting letter for sure. I'd say the range...   Mar 30 2011, 10:41 AM
- - Mineral Estate Grantee   The Forest Service and BLM (as well other agencies...   Mar 30 2011, 07:22 PM
- - realnice   Ok, so sorry for being away for a while. Life just...   Jul 14 2011, 12:05 PM
- - Coalbunny   If I were in your shoes, I would get all your duck...   Aug 2 2011, 01:09 AM
- - realnice   Ok, going in for another meeting today in a few ho...   Aug 23 2011, 10:53 AM
- - OkieJon   Realnice,Any updates?   May 7 2012, 12:44 PM
- - realnice   ...I paid the bond and am operating again..They tr...   Jul 5 2013, 09:40 AM
|- - Mrs.CP   QUOTE (realnice @ Jul 5 2013, 09:40 AM) ....   Jul 7 2013, 08:44 AM
- - swizz   Very good news!   Jul 5 2013, 05:31 PM
- - realnice   No . I'm still limited to hand tools   Jul 8 2013, 09:01 AM
- - Mrs.CP   That doesn't even seem right of the forest ser...   Jul 9 2013, 10:44 AM
- - Caveman   Realnice, is your claim located in an ACEC (Area o...   Jul 9 2013, 11:21 AM
|- - swizz   QUOTE (Caveman @ Jul 9 2013, 11:21 AM) ...   Jul 9 2013, 02:59 PM
|- - Caveman   QUOTE (swizz @ Jul 9 2013, 03:59 PM) well...   Jul 9 2013, 09:41 PM
- - swizz   I've never heard of ACEC. New designation? Wha...   Jul 9 2013, 10:13 PM
- - Caveman   I just ran into this, I do not know how long it ha...   Jul 9 2013, 10:54 PM
|- - swizz   QUOTE (Caveman @ Jul 9 2013, 10:54 PM) Go...   Jul 10 2013, 05:54 AM
- - russau   im not as up-to-date as many are here but it sure ...   Jul 10 2013, 05:43 AM
- - Caveman   Both of the places I want to work near here are in...   Jul 10 2013, 06:16 AM
- - swizz   I have been enlightened regarding ACEC (and I shou...   Jul 12 2013, 09:04 AM
- - ColoradoProspector   You're welcome Chris. I'd heard of the ...   Jul 12 2013, 11:08 AM
- - Caveman   SOOoooooo....... I do not have to file a POO to us...   Jul 12 2013, 01:15 PM
- - swizz   Who owns the land?   Jul 12 2013, 02:01 PM
- - ColoradoProspector   QUOTE (Caveman @ Jul 12 2013, 01:15 PM) S...   Jul 12 2013, 02:02 PM
- - Caveman   Interesting...... there are mining claims there (...   Jul 12 2013, 03:37 PM
- - ColoradoProspector   Right Caveman, a POO (plan of operation) is only f...   Jul 15 2013, 10:44 AM
- - Caveman   Well, I have highjacked this thread long enough, s...   Jul 16 2013, 09:05 AM
- - realnice   Havent been around a while. To answer a few questi...   Dec 16 2014, 12:55 PM
|- - swizz   QUOTE (realnice @ Dec 16 2014, 11:55 AM) ...   Dec 16 2014, 05:53 PM
- - EMac   Interesting thread; thanks for the bump today real...   Dec 16 2014, 02:52 PM
- - ColoradoProspector   I’m still a bit confused on this scenario realnice...   Dec 21 2014, 09:08 PM
- - Caveman   It appears the USFS is not honoring the POO - even...   Dec 22 2014, 06:30 PM
- - Mrs.CP   QUOTE (realnice @ Dec 16 2014, 11:55 AM) ...   Dec 23 2014, 12:29 PM
- - Caveman   I suspect that's it - but it may not be..... I...   Dec 23 2014, 06:55 PM
- - realnice   Just checking in on this thread as I do occasional...   Apr 25 2017, 01:43 PM
- - CP   Thanks realnice but I was not confused at all I kn...   Apr 26 2017, 07:00 PM


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