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Colorado Rare Earth Minerals
swizz
post Oct 21 2014, 07:36 AM
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Thanks for this Mike... and thanks to Dan & Denise I have a digital scale again and can do this. I have a lot of stuff I want to test, will definitely help to narrow things down.


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Woody
post Oct 29 2014, 08:58 AM
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Yeah I really wiffed that Xenotime,

When I scanned the description of the mineral I reead a few things that right off the bat made me think it might be a good fit.

- Often grows in contact with other minerals, like on the side.
- Can have a redish huge to it.
- Heavier than quartz.


Well this piece fit those nicely. It is growing on the side of a Smokie, Red/Purpleish color, and it is heavier thatn quartz. But that whole 4-sidded thing is a no go instantly.

So for fun I did that gravity test that you mentioned. Of course I could not test just the one mineral by it's self and had to do the entire piece. It came up with a solid 3, heavy for Qurtz but light for Fluorite. Mixing the two I'd say it is just a fancy piece of Fluorite. But the gravity test worked, Can't wait to do it with other specimens. Thanks again Mike, Woody.
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MikeS
post Oct 29 2014, 05:41 PM
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QUOTE (Woody @ Oct 29 2014, 09:58 AM) *
Thanks again Mike, Woody.

Your welcome! Your piece is very perplexing. The newer pic shows much more purple color which still looks like quartz (Amethyst) but it looks almost like it grew off another crystal (brown) which is shaped a bit odd for quartz. With a heavy gravity test it either means there are heavy impurities in the quartz or you have something else going on (assuming the test was near accurate). I'll have to take a closer look some day.


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MikeS
post Jan 9 2015, 07:15 PM
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After months of intense mineral investigations we think we have identified another Rare Earth Mineral on some of our finds from 2014. After several baths in SIO some of our quartz and feldspar showed "micro balls" on them that were yellow to red color, and that are translucent to transparent. The tiny specimens have a greasy luster and seem to have a conchoidal fracture. Without more advanced tests the most likely mineral that "fits the bill" may be more rare than Xenotime-(Y).

Here are some pics of what we believe is Florencite-(Ce)
(Not to be confused with Fluocerite-(Ce). greensmilies-025.gif )

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fenixsmom
post Jan 9 2015, 07:55 PM
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MIKEY!!! Hell of a find buddy!!!!
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Coalbunny
post Jan 10 2015, 06:04 AM
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QUOTE (MikeS @ Oct 14 2014, 05:08 PM) *
Tested the Zenotime for radiation. It has detectable radiation but very low, approx. 30 counts per min. Just above background readings.

30 CPM...of alpha, beta or gamma? What model of GM counter? Age of GM counter? Last calibration?

Not picking an issue, but things to consider.
I was out prospecting a month back, panned the sediments, and no colors found. However, the CMP was 120-ish, and the background is already 120-ish. Beta shield was not in place, so I'm not sure what the background CPMs are in comparison to the concentrates. I as expecting to get some elevated CPMs, and since it was indistinguishable from background, I'm baffled as is a couple of geologists I know. Hmmm.

That's why you want to know the CPM in either alpha, beta, or gamma. If you have 120 CPM combined and 120 CPM background, you could still have something. That combined reading could be 50 CPM beta and 70 CPM gamma for background and 90 CPM beta with 30 CPM gamma for the concentrates.


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Denise
post Jan 10 2015, 10:10 AM
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Very nice find Mike and great pictures!! smiley-clapping.gif thumbsupsmileyanim.gif


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MikeS
post Jan 10 2015, 11:17 AM
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QUOTE (Coalbunny @ Jan 10 2015, 05:04 AM) *
30 CPM...of alpha, beta or gamma? What model of GM counter? Age of GM counter? Last calibration?


I know very little about radiation testing but my good friend has an old counter that has been in his family for a while. He knows much more than me about it and he did some clean up work at Rocky Flats so he was required to know some of the basics. When I talk with him next I will ask about these questions and if I remember right he mentioned that his counter was likely in need of calibration.


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Dave S.
post Jan 10 2015, 11:36 AM
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30 CPM...of alpha, beta or gamma? What model of GM counter? Age of GM counter? Last calibration?


Well COALBUNNY, the short answer is we don't know. The geiger counter is a friends, and it is OLD. I think he said the 1960's. It probably has not been calibrated since then either. My friend worked at Rocky Flats during the "Big Clean Up" some years back, and he knows much more about his machine, and how HE got the number 30 RPM. Mike S. (my brother) was only repeating a number he was told. I may have my friend test the suspected FLORENCITE-(Ce) for radiation, and ask him your questions. The counter was made for the Department of Defense during the cold war. And I have no idea what type of radiation it detects. For the most part I just wanted to calm my brothers fears that the crystal may be dangerous. I was pretty sure of my mineral identification (99%), and did not expect a high reading before the test took place. The suspected XENOTIME-(Y) crystal gave us a specific gravity of (5.0333) in a home gravity test. That number helped us eliminate some other possibilities ( Zircon, Thorite, Pyrochlore, etc..)


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Dave S.
post Jan 10 2015, 12:07 PM
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Some more INFO that I DO KNOW:

Xenotime-(Y) is a Yttrium Phosphate Y(PO4)
Gravity range (4.4 -5.1)
Mohs hardness (4 - 5) between fluorite and apatite


Florencite-(Ce) is an Anhydrous Phosphate of Cerium CeAl3(PO4)2(OH6)
Gravity range (3.457 - 3.71)
Mohs hardness (5 - 6) between apatite and feldspars


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Denise
post Jan 10 2015, 12:10 PM
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Welcome to the forums Dave!! thumbsupsmileyanim.gif Excellent info to know, thanks for adding it to this thread! happy112.gif


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fenixsmom
post Jan 10 2015, 12:44 PM
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About time you hopped on the forum Dave! thumbsupsmileyanim.gif
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MikeS
post Jan 10 2015, 01:09 PM
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Welcome back to the forums brother! thumbsupsmileyanim.gif Hope to see ya round here more often. smiley-cool14.gif


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Dave S.
post Jan 10 2015, 03:25 PM
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Thank you all! thumbsupsmileyanim.gif Some more interesting notes:

The Florencite-(Ce) in the pics also have other suspected rare-earth minerals, or rare minerals in the samples:

Yellow crust: Probably just limonite , but might be, or contain Liebigite ( a hydrated carbonate), Kasolite ( lead/ uranium neosilicate), or massicot (lead oxide).

Bladed pink crystals(in the last pic, just right of center): I suspect these criss-crossing bladed crystals may be synchysite-(Y) a rare-earth carbonate of the element yttrium.

Black, metallic, mass ( not in any of the pics ) : I suspect this slightly irridecent, stringy mass to be part of the columbite-tantalite group (probably Mangancolumbite, with the elements manganese, niobium, and or tantalum). But may also be another rare mineral called Todorokite.


....More testing, and expertise needed for some of these....

However these specimens also contain Hematite(small black spheres with florencite-(Ce), and red coatings), and chlorite mica (green).


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Dave S.
post Jul 30 2015, 08:11 PM
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thumbsupsmileyanim.gif Prospected Devils Head Area for the first time. Found some pretty good crystals of Smokey Quartz, Feldspar(almost amazonite). But I also found this heavy ,somewhat ugly rock. It was a surface find.

After some test and research, I think it is a sample of the rare-earth minerals:

Furgesonite-(Y) [YNbO4] --- (Yttrium Niobium Oxide)

*Black and Brown "waxy" mass to the left in Pic#1


Samarskite-(Y) [(Y,Fe3+,Fe2+, U, Th, Ca)(Nb,Ta)] --- (Yttrium, Iron"isotopes", Uranium, Thorium, Calcium, Niobium, Tantalum, ... Oxide!)
(also often contains significant amounts of Titanium)

*Ugly red "nodule" to the right in Pic#1


It is hard to find good crystals of these minerals, due to radioactive decay.

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The backside

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